Colivers Club Ep 20: Minimalist Nomadism, Crypto Colivings, and Reinventing Toilets – A Conversation with Theo Villard
🌍 Minimalism, crypto, and reinventing toilets? Yep, we covered it all!
Meet Theo, a self-proclaimed minimalist nomad who counted his possessions during COVID (99 items!), built a startup, took a multi-year sabbatical, and even dreamed of launching a crypto-powered coliving. Oh, and he’s got strong opinions on toilets. 🚽😂
From burnout and sabbaticals to the future of coliving communities, this episode is packed with deep insights and plenty of laughs!
💭 Would you try a crypto-coliving or join a co-village? Let’s discuss in the comments! ⬇️
Read the Interview
César: Hello everyone, welcome to another episode of Colivers Club. Today I‘m joined by Theo. Hello Theo. Hey. Well, Theo likes to build stuff and crypto, more or less. That would be a good introduction. And you also share your views in beautiful writing in your blog post. And yeah, you’ve been nomadine for quite a while. You were in charge of a company, then took a sabbatical, and now you are an employee again. It‘s been quite a ride, right? How are you feeling?
Theo: Hi.
César: My first question, because also I saw that in your introduction and in your LinkedIn and Twitter and website, because I stalked you a lot for this interview. You say that you are a minimalist nomad. I wanted to know more about that. What makes you a minimalist nomad?
Theo: Well, it used to be a joke. During COVID, I was very bored and I did try to count how many items were in my suitcase. And somehow I reached 99. So it became like, I wrote this article, I‘ve got 99 items. And yeah, I was already in this mood of removing stuff or keeping only the essential. And yeah, so I called myself a minimalist. I know that some people feel like they don’t like, I don‘t know, they make them a bit upset somehow. I don’t know why, but like, yeah, minimalist is about removing what‘s not the Marie Kondo stuff, removing what’s not bringing you joy somehow, or what‘s not essential for you. But doesn’t mean you have to have like only one t–shirt or, but in my case, I don‘t have many items. I don’t know how many items I have now, but not a lot. Yeah. And so, yeah, it used to be my tagline, minimalist nomad. It‘s still my tagline because that’s, yeah, that‘s what I, it’s a good way to describe what I‘m doing. I’m a nomad and I just have a suitcase and a backpack and some stuff at my parents.
César: Of course, that‘s universal locker space for nomads. What do you think about your parents?
Theo: Kind of be perfect. If you‘re too perfect, it’s weird. But the trick is that actually the things that at my parents, I don‘t own them. I just, I just rent them from them. So my skis, they belong to my parents. I just borrow them for free.
César: Well, okay. Nice.
Theo: Yeah, that‘s the trick. So I don’t like, I don‘t have to. Yeah.
César: Is this a service that can be used for by other nomads or only by their children?
Theo: Looks like it‘s only like, it’s only my name. Yeah,
César: I went through a process last year where I sold almost everything I owned. Like, yeah, and it was so liberating. And I have an ocean where I keep track of my essentials and the things I travel with. And I really like the idea. I have five t–shirts, you know, and the t–shirts that I own now are super high quality. I love it, you know. And before I used to have like 20 t–shirts, I always wear the same five.
Theo: Anyways, yeah.
César: Anyway, so, and yeah, it‘s just a matter of choosing quality or quantity for me.
Theo: What made you sell everything? You were about to travel?
César: Yeah, I had a, I was renting an apartment. It was too big and it was like, okay, but I, a few years ago I went to nine co–living and something switched, you know, I was like, oh, I want to pursue this for a while. So I sold everything I owned with the idea of moving to Tenerife and from there, I started selling it in a base and then traveling to other co–living, which is what I did. So yeah, for me, it was important to have few things, fewer things, but the idea stayed with me and I really liked it.
Theo: Yeah, it‘s easier like to remove stuff when you’re traveling, moving out, breaking up with someone. We
César: don‘t recommend people to break up with somebody in order to become a minimalist. That’s not the…
Theo: When I left Paris, I think I left like so many, so many clothes in the basement of my ex and I never picked it up. So there you go.
César: Oh, okay.
Theo: Yeah, gone, but it‘s better.
César: Yeah, but I think it‘s a good pursuit, you know, minimally same and sustainability. I think there’s also some parallelism, like we don‘t need so many things.
Theo: You consume less, like, yeah, I don‘t buy, I don’t buy things, physical things. I don‘t have Amazon, for instance. When I buy something, like you said, I buy super high quality stuff, or just fancy shirts. This one is my new one. It’s actually not high quality, but yeah, anyway. But I guess more and more people are doing this. I say more and more, but at the same time, you have things like sheen or teemu, it‘s a new trend also. So you have some people going crazy on the consumption side, but you see also people maybe more like us, like, preferring to buy less, but better.
César: Yeah, I think it‘s also a common trend in co-leavings, right? I think we share very similar ideas to other co-leavers.
Theo: Yeah, that‘s why we live in a bubble, so it’s hard to maybe to tell what‘s happening outside.
César: Sometimes, yes.
Theo: Yeah, hopefully, at some point, people will realize that the quality of our quantity is often better.
César: And I mentioned in your introduction that you took a sabbatical. Yeah, you took several sabbaticals, because after one year, it has happened. Yes, yes. What happened there?
Theo: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Actually, it‘s a recommendation. Never take only one year, or at least take two years, basically. Because if you take only one year, after six months, you’re going to be thinking about your next move. If you take two years, you can actually have a full year, because it takes time to switch, to stop your mind, even if you want to switch carrier, and it takes a long time. But yeah, I used to have my own startup in crypto, and as it happens, often, I fell out with my co–founder, and it was a very painful decision in the months of March 2021. But I left the company and got some money from that. And then I was like, “Okay, I’m going to focus on my own things.” Yeah, it was like my, not my midlife, hopefully, but my 30 years old crisis, 30th crisis, I don‘t know, bought a car, started traveling in Europe, and exploring some topics that, you know, like when you have a job, especially when it’s your startup, you‘re super focused on that, so you don’t have time to really dive deeper in other topics. And it could be any topics, but basically being like, “Okay, I want to research this thing, I want to know a lot more, it takes time.” And so yeah, I read a lot, which is amazing, which I‘m not doing now, for instance. And I did some small projects here and there, like experimenting with technologies. I had a big research project that I started also that year. So that was kind of first year, and also start, maybe we’re going to talk about that, the crypto colliding idea. I started that, then the second year, at Sarbati, I kind of tried to switch carrier to going to security, like not cyber security, but crypto audits, doing security audits and other things. And the third year, I can‘t remember what happened, but I think I went, yeah, I was still doing that and experimenting again with some small things. I got obsessed with the idea of reinventing the toilet. I spent a lot of time on that. And yeah, I mean, it takes time and yeah, some, I tried things, I failed, but I’m glad that I had the opportunity and I had a good life. And now, yeah, after three years, I was like, “I missed having a team, I needed a bit more money.” Sometimes. And so yeah, I had the opportunity to join a good project again. So I was like, “Okay, let’s try it.” But yeah, it‘s different, obviously, to have to show up five days a week, it’s a bit weird, we can talk about that.
César: So yeah, because sometimes in collivings, I see quite often people taking sabbatical, so apart from the recommendation of taking more than one year, what would you recommend them?
Theo: Yeah, I think you‘re right. Like in collivings, you usually go to collivings and then you’re like, “Oh, I want to quit my job.”
César: Every colliving has one personality.
Theo: Because you have people like being, like, you say, like prioritizing life. Or work. Or work. And so maybe you get inspired, like thinking, “Oh, that was also one thing I realized a long time ago, thanks to the colliving life, that time, whatever you’re doing, whatever, like, no matter the amount of money you have, time is the most valuable asset.” Time, you know? And so you have to make sure to spend your time very wisely, like, “Oh, yeah, you have to be very deliberate with your time.” So yeah, maybe like when you go to collivings, you get inspired. And what was your question?
César: Yeah, the recommendations for people taking more than taking a sabbatical.
Theo: Um, yeah, I don‘t know, like, I guess, recommendation maybe is to try collivings. But then be careful that you might actually enjoy it. Too much. Too much. And also you might end up changing your current setup with work. Which is a good thing.
César: I mean, it makes you question what you want, right? To mean that‘s an important question to ask myself, “What do I want?“
Theo: True. But you can say also that ignorance is bliss, you know?
César: Ah, not knowing that there‘s a possibility.
Theo: I think I have some friends that are super happy in the normal traditional life, you know? A job, a car, a wife, a kid, a house. And they‘re not unhappy. I think they’re happy and they don‘t really think about, they don’t see an option and they don‘t really ask themselves too many questions. And maybe that’s…
César: But I see that as a double–edged sword, right? Maybe in the future, they 10 years go by and they‘re like, “What did I do?” And then you start having some regrets. But I think every decision you make needs to come from acceptance. That, “Okay, if I choose this path, I’m deliberate, I‘m intentional and I accept.” And that’s it.
Theo: You can be like, “Yeah, I accept this. It’s my life. I have two kids.”
César: I have two kids. I cannot undo them.
Theo: “I have to wait at least 20 years before I can have a life again.” Yeah, I guess acceptance. Or ignorance.
César: Ignorance. We go with ignorance. Yeah, you mentioned as well, like, if you go to colivings, you might change your current setup or maybe even you want to build your own coliving.
Theo: I think it‘s happening all the time, right? I tried it. I think you want to do it as well.
César: At some point, yes.
Theo: Yeah, at some point, I would go to colivings and there‘s always one person being like, “Oh, I want to start a coliving.” And in reality, it’s very hard to start a good coliving. So unfortunately, it doesn‘t happen that much. But yeah, a lot of people, they see this new life and they’re like, “Oh, wow, this is amazing. I want to have my own or I want to create something like this.” And I wanted to do that as well. But yeah, we can talk about it later, but it‘s difficult.
César: Yeah, because you wanted to build a coliving. Yeah, the main idea was to use crypto and mix it with a coliving. And I‘m very interested in this, if you want to explain.
Theo: Definitely. So yeah, the project was crypto coliving. I think you can still find the web page online.
César: It‘s the website?
Theo: Crypto–coliving.xyz. I think I‘m still up and running because it was a beautiful website. It is.
César: I saw it.
Theo: Very good. I didn‘t do the design, but yeah. So yeah, the idea was to… So I think my view is that a good coliving is not like… It’s a business, but it‘s never going to be like a billion dollar business. A good coliving has to be something… It’s not a money–making business, right? It‘s more like a mission-driven business or whatever. So I think it’s very well suited for non–profit or something in that spirit of… It‘s not about making money. It’s about…
César: Connecting people.
Theo: Yeah, living a different life. But then you don‘t want to end up in this kind of utopian thinking, and then you create these communities. And it always falls apart because people are fighting or whatever. So you need still a business kind of… You need an entity controlling the coliving. So crypto-coliving, this idea of basically using crypto, but in a non-bullshit way. So just like you need to be a member, and a member is just a membership, like a member of an association. It was actually in Spain. So it’s like… I think in Spain it‘s called… yeah, “Associa” “Associa” “Associa” “Sin animo de luclo” So you become a member, and as a member you can actually book this coliving. And just instead of paying with paying on, let’s say, on the old school payment rates, you would pay with crypto. And then your membership would be like a nice NFT made by a friend who‘s an artist. What is the thing? Also, the important part would be around governance. So that nobody can… Nobody owns the coliving, but it’s like you have to vote on everything. And you vote in… Not using… Also the idea was to experiment, like not using one person, one vote, but using like a quadratic voting. And now it‘s like this idea of… If you really care about something, maybe… So in the end, like let’s say every year you get… Everybody gets like a thousand votes, but they can decide to put… I want to put 500 votes on this thing. For instance, for me it would be like, “Change the toilet.” I would put all my votes on this. But maybe some people, they care a lot about something else. So it‘s like this idea of quadratic voting. But yeah, that’s what’s… So mixing like real life use case for crypto with a coliving, and this idea of governance, especially like the… So managed by the community, but still having someone in charge who can actually kick someone out if someone is like not behaving properly. And yeah, it was in Granada, Spain, beautiful house. And but yeah, but so...
César: So did you manage to… The house was there, right? Did you…
Theo: Yeah, we visited the house. We had like the budget. We started like doing this launch. Basically it was like an NFT launch, but we needed like at least three millions to buy the house. Three millions? Wow. Buy the house, renovate it. It was a big house in the center of Granada, so yeah, expensive. And this was at the moment the crypto market was kind of like already a bit shaky. And other things, other reasons, but yeah, it didn‘t work out. And I think I wrote a post-mortem about it on my blog. And yeah, so the idea is dead. There were a lot after that, a lot of people contacted me because they were keen to try something similar. But as far as I know, it’s not yet a thing. There are some crypto communities doing… It‘s called Zuzalu. Actually, they’re going to be in Chiang Mai for one month in November. They book the entire thing. So it‘s more like pop-up crypto thing with their own economy.
César: That‘s cool because it’s a good way of testing the waters before having to commit to a place.
Theo: Maybe if you can find something that‘s already occurring, you can accommodate for… Maybe, yeah, the way we tried it was maybe too big, too many miracles needed to make it.
César: So what was the main overview of why it failed, you think? I will put the link to the post–mortem so you get more views on your blog post. But if you can give us a little bit of what you think it failed.
Theo: I think it boils down to this thing. I wanted to be kind of a side project, but in the end, it was a real big thing. And I was already working basically my entire time on it, but it would have required a team, basically, a startup vibe, building something, creating, finding people to be part of it. And maybe the market was still not big enough for people to be… Because it wasn‘t about making money, it was about doing something cool.
César: So Granada, both.
Theo: Yeah, but you need people to be excited about something that‘s not about making money. And unfortunately, in crypto, yeah.
César: If you didn‘t do it with crypto, do you think it would have succeeded or not?
Theo: No, I think it‘s maybe the same. I think it would have required more energy from the team, more time, basically, finding, creating the story around it and just running it as more as a normal business at the beginning and then turning it into a community. But yeah, it was a big thing.
César: And the people will need to pay in crypto. There will be other choices. So when
Theo: I say crypto, it‘s Euro crypto, for instance. So I can now pay you in euros, but it’s actually these euros. Instead of being in a bank, they‘re in my wallet, but they are still euros.
César: So when I think about crypto, I think that the level of entry is very high. So how would you have accommodated people that are not crypto? How would you have accommodated people that are not crypto friendly?
Theo: Yeah, but now when I say crypto, basically, now I can give you an eiban. And I say, send me euros on this eiban. Actually, when you send me euros, it gets converted to crypto. So it‘s like now the very easy conversion between crypto and we call it the fiat world. So the normal or the sorry, the old banking system. Yes, it’s actually very easy now and it‘s regulated. It’s not like some kind of shady thing. So for instance, this company in Iceland, they have an e–money license. So they can emit money the same way like when you put money in Revolut. It‘s not euros anymore. It’s Revolut euros. They don‘t exist physically. But Revolut has a license so they can actually emit money. They can say, OK, you can have a wallet. You can have an account saying you have euros. But it can be crypto behind the scenes. And that’s basically now what‘s happening and also what I’m working on at the moment. So all this world of like, it‘s called stablecoins. So it’s like crypto but pegged to euros, dollars.
César: Yeah, the third type.
Theo: And maybe for some people, it‘s the first time they hear about it. But it’s already like trillion, trillion dollar per year, more than trillions per year, like already settled with this and big, big companies like actually the banks, unfortunately, and Visa, they‘re already using this to settle because it’s like instant. Yeah, the old the old banking system is obviously fucked because it was busy in the 60s with this thing. Exactly. So yeah, it‘s not efficient.
César: So yeah, absolutely. It‘s a very interesting idea. And the idea of governance is super cool. Because I mean, I think the colivings are community oriented for sure. But they are dictatorships at the end of the day. There’s the owner and they choose everything. But I think they tend to listen to the colivers. So I‘m wondering also what will be the dynamics of this idea of really choosing together. Because you will need a lot of politics. Maybe you want to take the toilets, but maybe I don’t. So we need to convince the others not to.
Theo: Yeah, I mean, that‘s why you can vote and then you have to accept. I guess accept and accept. You cannot make it work. If your vote doesn’t. If it doesn‘t go through, but then you have to accept. But even in this governance thing, I would still have a manager of the place. Right. So maybe every year or every you elect someone who’s in charge and can actually enforce rules and also be in charge.
César: And this person will get paid as a manager.
Theo: So like directly getting paid, automatically getting paid from the treasury of the coliving.
César: Oh, from the crypto, right? Yeah. That‘s very cool.
Theo: It‘s like so transparent, you know, everything. Open. Boditable, open. No secrets. Let’s see, maybe for your next career. We can chat.
César: Yeah, we can chat now. For me, it will take a few years still.
Theo: Where do you want to do your coliving?
César: I would love to do the Madrid, which is my home city, but in the outskirts. I‘m thinking about the less Korea. Maybe Toledo. So in the outskirts, it’s very accessible to Madrid.
Theo: Yeah.
César: But yeah, it‘s going to take some time.
Theo: Like you don‘t want to do it in a big city.
César: Yeah, I think it never works. Yeah, it‘s just because you need a big space, right?
Theo: A big space and you need like you kind of want people to be stuck together.
César: Yeah, you want to force them.
Theo: Yeah, be like you have nothing else to do then to connect. Connect with. Yeah.
César: Yeah. Also, money wise makes sense.
Theo: Yeah, money wise, in Madrid now, I cannot imagine.
César: It‘s impossible.
Theo: Imagine this property.
César: No, no, no way. So we talked about getting burnt out. I see also people in colivins that are in the process of being burnt out and they use the colivins as maybe as an escape. Or they were burnt out and they‘re using colivins as a way to heal. So what can you tell us about your process? True.
Theo: Yeah, in my case, it was not officially a burnout. Just, yeah, I was working too much because of my own startup and I was working a lot. And my mind was always on this. And then I think it was after the summer 2020 and I had these moments where I would feel, I don‘t know, I would feel like so bad, you know, but it’s just physically. Physically, but not like, I cannot explain not like physical pain more like, you know, when you feel like super stressed, but to the point that you‘re, you can’t breathe. You‘re like, you go outside, you walk and you don’t feel good. It‘s just like,
César: And you‘re not living in the moment, right? You are in the future, which is stress or in the past, which is anxiety.
Theo: Yeah, exactly. You‘re like, you’re not in the moment and you‘re just painful. So this time, yeah, I don’t know. Like I was, maybe I was listening to podcasts at this time just to, to chill. And there was this podcast about the four, four day work week. So this idea of you, instead of working five days, you work four days. It‘s like, and, and the guy was saying, yeah, basically because you work less, you, you’re happier and you‘re happier, you work better. So you actually, you’re more productive. So you, you work better and you, so it‘s like this, this circle. And so I was like, okay, wow. You know, let’s, let‘s try it at my company because it‘s my own company. So I can try things. And, and that’s why it started, it started to go down with my co-founder because it‘s, it‘s, it‘s silly because this guy is like my, my same age as mine. But he was like, no, no, I don’t want us to work only four days. I‘m like, man, it‘s stupid. Like you do why like
César: four days by the same hours. Like you put 10 hours. Yeah.
Theo: It‘s in the end, it’s your own companies. You can decide things. And it‘s in the past we used to work six days a week.
César: So not why it hasn‘t changed in a hundred years, right? I think, yeah.
Theo: Okay. Well, yeah, but before it was, it‘s like random decision, random decision. It could be four, could be free, whatever. And so the idea would be to work four days, but everybody’s getting paid five. And that‘s it. Like, you know, and the idea is actually in the end as a business, it’s better. We did experiment that the following like January, February, it was for me, it was like amazing. Basically because you, I was working Monday, Tuesday, then Wednesday off and Thursday.
César: All right. So you have a middle day.
Theo: So good. Actually today, you know, it‘s Wednesday. I’m off.
César: Oh, you‘re doing four days a week.
Theo: I‘m doing just like this summer. I’m taking the Wednesday‘s off. Oh, okay. And for me, it’s like so good. It brings like, I know it‘s a good balance. You don’t have this feeling of, you know, waking up every day and doing the same thing. It‘s just kidding me. So you have this thing in the mid in between you can do.
César: A soft reset.
Theo: Yeah. It‘s a reset like starting. Yeah. So you, then you show up on Thursday and you’re fresh again. So yeah. So that was one thing I wanted to try. My co–founder, we had an argument. We had like different views on that. And yeah, when it comes to burnout, yeah, I see a lot of people also after or in a process of burnout at Colivings. But yeah.
César: What did you do to fix it?
Theo: Just chill.
César: Just chill. Okay. That‘s a sad thing. If you’re burnt out, just chill.
Theo: It‘s a recommendation from Sylvia from Nine. Oh yeah. She was like, just chill.
César: Just chill. But it‘s true. It’s like you need to, because I feel like our minds are prepared to see stress as a life threatening. Everything is life threatening in our mind, but it‘s not really like if you get, yeah, nowadays we’re safe and you need to tell yourself, I‘m safe. Like every idea of my work or the stress I get from work, I’m safe. Nothing‘s going to happen to me physically. I’m safe.
Theo: Yeah, nothing‘s going to happen. And also nothing matters really.
César: So yeah, everything‘s pointless.
Theo: Yeah, everything‘s pointless. You just look at the start and you’re like,
César: we are in a giant rock floating around space. Yeah.
Theo: So yeah, nobody cares about your, our problems are insignificant.
César: Yeah. To me, because I was in the same process a little bit ago and I think to me meditation helped me anchor myself in the present moment because I felt like for the longest time I wasn‘t really living in the present moment. Okay. I was physically there, but mentally I was somewhere else. So, and I could, so I visualized myself as the thesar was like floating around and there’s the physical thesar was like working or whatever, like with the stress and distance.
Theo: And you were already like, you were always always somewhere.
César: Yeah. And then I tried to bring this to myself and then it‘s like, oh, okay, I’m safe. I‘m chill. And it’s changed. It changes everything. But for sure. I think in it, especially we, there‘s a lot of burnout. I wonder why.
Theo: In IT?
César: Yeah. You have a background in IT, right? You‘re a developer.
Theo: But developers, I don‘t know, because also developers, they can do, they can be like princesses, no? Sometimes they don’t do much and they‘re chill and they don’t have a lot of pressure. Yeah, true. But if you put the, I don‘t know what was your position, you were maybe like, you were more at a higher position and then you have more stress.
César: Yeah, maybe a little bit.
Theo: But if you‘re a developer at the bottom of the chain, it’s very chill. I think it‘s very,
César: yeah, it depends on the type of personality because I think I’m easily obsessed with doing things in a perfectionist way.
Theo: Yeah, okay. Appressionism is a mind killer.
César: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You need to kill the mind because the mind kills you. But yeah, I think I also see it in, because when I go to colivings, I see a lot of people that are smart and they really are perfectionists as well. And maybe that‘s why there’s a correlation of people here that are also getting burnt out. And yeah, it‘s hard to deal with, but also therapy, therapy helps a lot, for sure.
Theo: But did you start like going to colivings after kind of your burnout?
César: I was in the process of being burnt out and I went through a breakup, of course. So I was like, oh, I never traveled alone. Let me go to this place somebody told me about, not in colivings. And I was like, wow. And I remember going after being there a month, I came back home and I was like, oh, I feel energized, but I‘ve been working and I’ve actually put more hours even. So it was like a nice interesting feeling. So yeah, I think this marked a moment where I would start looking more inward and be introspective and see, oh, I need this. There‘s this other thing that is preventing me from being in the moment. I think being in colivings makes me appreciate more living in the moment.
Theo: Oh yeah, 100%. I think that‘s what I was, my first thought about coliving was like, oh, we all live in the moment. It’s like, yeah, you‘re with people in a house or you’re having fun or whatever. And yeah, it‘s just you’re just in the current.
César: Yeah, you need to go with the flow.
Theo: The eternal now.
César: Yeah. So, but there‘s challenges, the form, all right? There’s so many things going on that you have fear of. And to me at the beginning was challenging as well. I don‘t know, it’s for you the same?
Theo: Yeah, with form I‘m good. I’m actually enjoying missing out sometimes. But yeah, when you join a new coliving, you want to join activities. Otherwise, there‘s no point. Also, that’s how you create connections and memories with activities. But something I don‘t like to do, I am not joining. Something I don’t like.
César: Yeah, it also depends on the colivings, right? Because I think the word is being misused a lot. So if you want a list of curated colivings, please check out Mapmelon. They are the sponsors of this podcast.
Theo: Yes, yes, yes.
César: Yeah, but absolutely because…
Theo: So many people are using the word colivings.
César: For just the sake of, oh, it‘s trendy.
Theo: It‘s just a shared, but they completely misusing the word. But there’s no… You cannot trademark a word, like there‘s no point anywhere. But yeah, a coliving is not just sharing a house.
César: Yeah.
Theo: It‘s like living together.
César: Absolutely. That‘s the name. Oh, shit. Oh, no. And yeah, we have the ideas of colivings and we have now the ideas of covillages. You have opinions about this. And I want also to explain to us and the audience about the toilets, but we will talk about this later.
Theo: I‘m sorry, it’s more important.
César: Okay, okay. But no, no, no, yeah.
Theo: Yeah, covillages. Yeah, I think it was last year and I was here actually, and I wrote this article about the normal life and…
César: We‘re here in Burgas Coliving, by the way.
Theo: In Burgas Coliving.
César: Which is amazing. You should definitely check it out.
Theo: Very, very good place. And any articles, sorry, I thought about what could be the end game for someone like me. I‘m basically going from colivings to colivings, but maybe in long term, having some kind of… Not a base, but somewhere I can stay ever longer. Because a coliving, I think you don’t want to… Some people do that, but it‘s weird. You don’t want to spend six months at the same coliving. Six months, a long time. Your energy is going to go down. It‘s not going to work that well. So, yeah, I wrote this article and I imagined these col villages. And somehow this article was my, I think, most popular article ever in my life.
César: Oh, wow.
Theo: Like to the point where people were sharing it. Like I didn‘t ask people to share. Usually I write an article and people are like, “Yeah.“
César: I shared it as well, so I get a commission, right? How many views it got?
Theo: I‘m not tracking views, but it’s like the amount of people like re–sharing it.
César: Oh, okay.
Theo: Yeah. So somehow, yeah, it‘s resonated a lot with people and it’s like… Because in the end, it‘s this idea of how do you decide to live your life? Why are you living in a flat, alone, in a big city? Why?
César: And even if you‘re living alone, you have a lot of neighbors who you will never meet, you will never have interactions with, and they’re just there. And they might be very interesting people that align with your values and it‘s like no access to that.
Theo: I mean, when you live in a big city, you‘re just surrounded by strangers.
César: Because we choose to keep them as strangers.
Theo: Yeah, yeah.
César: So I wonder why.
Theo: Yeah, we have like… So that was my point in the article. Like we seem to be seeking privacy. We think we want to be alone in our own flat. And own. Own, you know, private, locking the doors. But then in the end, you end up super alone and it‘s depressing. So yeah, big surprise, maybe villages is a good way to live. So the idea of co-villages is maybe still having co-living, but around the co-living, you have small houses or like houses, people living longer term around the co-living. So they can still participate in the co-living activities, but maybe less intensely. I mean, it’s not like, it‘s not a new idea, but… And you see that happening at nine, you have a lot of people who stayed around nine, I mean, Puerto on the island.
César: That was one of those people.
Theo: You were one of these people. And at Clad Citadel, the same like people that now live in Brionçon. So it makes sense because then you have a community because you don‘t want to move alone to a village in the mountains.
César: In the middle of nowhere.
Theo: Or in Tenerife. But then if you have like, you start to have a community and it feels much better. But yeah, so the co–village was this idea of somewhere having a co–living and around that co–living, small houses, that maybe you can stay actually, you can actually stay six months per year, but it will be still managed by someone. So the community is still managed. You don‘t want to leave it completely like self-organized because it’s harder to make it work. And I forgot my other points, but that‘s it.
César: They were very good points.
Theo: They were very good points. And I generated some images with AI and the villages looked interesting.
César: Because I also see there‘s some challenges when you have an established co-living. And of course, people want to participate in the co-living life with this co-living. There’s also the question that there are people living there and maybe they are not really keen on letting these other people that are living around, but they are not living in the co–living. So they‘re kind of strangers. As an owner of a co-living or manager, how do you balance? Because you don’t want to let, “Oh yeah, everybody from the town or that I know, they can go in the co–living.“
Theo: Yeah, definitely. Yeah, I know what you mean. It’s like when you’re in co-living, it‘s like this group and anyone from the other side, you’re always a bit like...
César: Yeah, for example, in Tartulia, Francesco refers to this as the diffuse community, which is like around. Around, okay. But there needs to be some rules, no?
Theo: Yeah, exactly. That‘s why it cannot just be random. It has to be organized. And so the space is as well as to be organized. Maybe it’s like there‘s a one space, which is co-working space for everyone. So you can… Nice co-working space, not just this, like a living space.
César: And the living facilities for the co–living.
Theo: So you can actually have people joining and spend time with them. Just don‘t have access to the bedrooms and all these parts.
César: How you organize it? Like any…
Theo: Yeah, I would start like this, like separating a bit, but still having these two groups of people like mixing, but also limiting the number of people and…
Theo: Yeah.
César: And what about the activities, for example? Because here, for example, we have in Burgas co–living, we have family meetings, family dinners, and then we set the schedule for the week. There‘s some activities that are done in the co-living. For example, tonight we have arts and crafts, but there are some that are done outside, right? Like a party or things. Would you limit this diffuse community to outside activities or you would have some...
Theo: I mean, that‘s a very good question also, because family meeting… I mean, for me, good co-living, if you don’t have a family meeting, it‘s not like… How can you organize a house if you don’t have a moment to sit down and just plan? So yeah, you want that, but if you cannot do that with… If you have more people outside, or you just limit the number of people outside living in the long–term co–living, and maybe these people, they just… They don‘t have to join all the time. They can join if they want. So maybe they just… They can join the family meeting, but they don’t have to, and they can join the activities, but they don‘t have to join all the activities. I think there’s something to be tested. Yeah, this was also this idea of maybe people want to raise a family, have kids, so they can live… But you don‘t want people with kids inside the coliving, it would be terrible. Next door, we’re trying to sleep now. But maybe they live actually in a small house nearby, and they can… So they have a different life, but they can still join activities when they want, and they can still be part of a community. And for them, I guess it‘s much better than raising kids alone.
César: I think a place like this, a co–village, where kids are living with their families, it‘s so good for the children, right? They get this international community, they can learn languages, and if you have multiple co-villages around the world, they can travel to this co-village. Yes, that’s the life.
Theo: And also, I guess if you have different people living the same life, you can also… Travel together. It‘s an idea of a tribe, no? Then the kid raised not just by… In parents, it’s more like a tribe.
César: But I think after all, we are capitalist hippies, right? Capitalist hippies, are we? Or no, how do you describe yourself? Are you more into the…
Theo: How do I describe myself? Next question. I don‘t know, but yeah, hippies… Something, something.
César: Yeah, because when I tell people that I like the co–living, co–living, community day, they tell me, “Ah, you are very hippie.” And I don‘t necessarily understand maybe why they have these prejudice, because I think there’s also some loaded…
Theo: For me, they don‘t like hippie because it sounds like we’re not taking showers.
César: Yeah, we are, yeah? Not together, separately. Separately. Oh, and going back to the bathroom, toilets, we need to learn more about this.
Theo: No time, we still on…
César: Yeah, a little bit of time. But this is very important. If we have to do it for one hour, more hour, the podcast, in order to talk about this, we will do it.
Theo: Toilets, man. Toilets are so bad. That‘s shitty. Yeah. I mean, especially, you want me to talk about toilets?
César: Yeah, go for it, man.
Theo: I‘m just gonna try to make it short, but basically, what’s wrong with toilets? So I came up with this list of the seven scenes. Of toilets. You probably agree with that. What‘s wrong? Okay, the sound, the smell, the splash, the stains, the position, the flush, and the worst of all, toilet paper. Toilet paper is the biggest scam of the universe. We used to have bidet and we know it’s better, but then bidet got kicked out. In Asia, they‘re still using bidet. They have guns, they have bidet. It’s great. So everything is wrong about toilets and we‘re wasting a lot of time on toilets, especially guys. For girls, it’s also a thing, but I noticed when I, guys, for guys, it‘s even bigger thing. So we waste so much time on just cleaning or something. Which is insane. We try to optimize it. People are optimizing things. We have better, faster things, but in the end, we still wipe our butts. The pharaohs were doing it in Egypt with pappiers. So I’m not saying modernity is always the answer, but in that case, something has to be done. So my point was to try to reinvent toilets from scratch.
César: So you designed a toilet.
Theo: Yeah, in the process of that, I would need now to find a studio to make a prototype.
César: Oh, wow. So you‘re serious about this?
Theo: Yeah, at some point, I thought maybe it‘s my biggest contribution to humanity. Like I can do, but then I joined another crypto wallet.
César: You could have been one or the other, right?
Theo: Exactly. But also, I‘m not like an industrial designer. So I don’t know much about that.
César: Maybe this is an opportunity for you to gather a team from the podcast listeners.
Theo: Yeah, if you‘re into toilets. So that’s why it‘s interesting because nobody cares about toilets. Right. It’s like, I think it‘s, I think we take them for granted. Yeah, it’s like a school. It‘s in front of us. It’s like doors. Nobody cares about doors. Not that much. Like, but then in the end, if you, it‘s like these basic things that are everywhere and it can be like some things are bad about them. I don’t know. I have nothing against doors, but toilets for sure.
César: And without getting too much into details about what would be your design because have you patented?
Theo: No, probably no patent. I want everybody to have no time.
César: Maybe you can share an overview of what would be the design because I‘m very curious about this.
Theo: I mean, it‘s just obviously is it going to be like, it’s going to be water. It‘s going to be no toilet paper, not just maybe a little bit the position. So the seat would incline when you sit on it because you squat, but not without squatting.
César: So it will need to be lower.
Theo: So you sit and then it goes down like it has an angle. It has an angle, but then, you know, yeah, the idea would also like not to use electricity. So you can replace the current toilets, which is just like water in, water out. So you do the same, but no flush. So it would be more like a continuous jet of water coming from inside.
César: So if there‘s no flush, it’s continuous. So it keeps running.
Theo: When you‘re on it. Yeah.
César: Oh, when you‘re on it. Okay.
Theo: So the idea is because the flush is like this problem of like, it‘s sending a lot of water at once. Sometimes it’s too much and sometimes it‘s not enough. So then you flush again. So in the end, it’s never perfect. And why it is happening at the end? Why do you keep your turds floating? Right? All these things like, I don‘t know, sometimes it’s really bad. And like some countries, if it works when I think it‘s in Germany, you know, is it in Germany? That is flat.
César: Ah, I hate that.
Theo: So you fit in a flat on a flat surface. Why? I never understood. Just love, I guess, I guess it‘s love stains. I don’t know. Yeah. So one other thing, I met this company a long time ago and they‘re making coatings. So you can spray your toilets, the bowl, and it’s got some nano hairs. Basically, it makes the surface very slippery.
César: Yeah. And use it once and it lasts a long time.
Theo: So you could, yeah, so it could be like, also like in a factory, you do it like this. So when you get your toilets, everything is like super slippery. So you don‘t have stains anymore. And it’s actually also very much better for health reasons. You know, every time you flush, you have actually this thing called, shit, I forgot the name, but basically the effect of the flush on your turd is making like, you have some spray, jumps. It‘s actually bad, you know? It’s like, not supposed to have sheets splashing. But that‘s what’s happening. Plumes, it‘s called plumes. Oh, okay. Yeah. I know too much about toilets.
César: No, but it‘s amazing. You can tell you’re a very passionate person and you put thought into these things. And that‘s good to challenge the status quo. Like, that’s how we improve.
Theo: Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. It‘ll be by, I’ll put you on my list.
César: Yeah, absolutely. We talked a little bit about the definition of co–living and I want to end this episode by asking, what does co–living mean to you?
Theo: Okay. Yeah. So how to keep it like simple. Co–living for me would be, I would say, happy together. Oh, okay.
César: That‘s good. That’s good.
Theo: I like it. It‘s two words. I mean, it’s not always about being happy, but just when you‘re together, when you are as a group, you cannot be happy alone. You can, but...
César: Yeah, it‘s very difficult because maybe you have a bad day, but then somebody has a good day and then you balance it out and they bring you out of this.
Theo: Yeah. Yeah. Like, I like this quote, like, bad day to co–living and still better than a good day at the office. Something.
César: Oh, okay.
Theo: I don‘t know who said that, but yeah. We said, I was listening to a podcast yesterday and not two days ago, but like this girl was a big expert explorer, like Swiss explorer, old lady when she died a long time ago. And she was saying like happiness is, what is it? She’s like being together, but when you‘re in harmony, like as a group. So yeah, this idea of being together, but also like together being in harmony. For me, I stay with happy together.
César: Okay. Well, it has been a pleasure having this talk with you. Very diverse topics. I love it.
Theo: Thank you for the chat.
César: No worries. Yeah, different things. Yeah. Well, this has been another episode of Collibris Club, powered by Mad Melon. Thank you to you and see you next time. Thank you. Bye.
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